Welcome back to Unstoppable REI Wealth. I've been on a mission to bring the experts, the guys who are the beasts of the industry who understand and maximize profits when it comes down to real estate investing and more recently the best for apartment investing. This is because I want to soak up the knowledge myself as much as I want to share the knowledge with all of you. Apartment investing is the next piece of my evolution where I'm going to be growing into. And so today I'm interviewing Mr. Jordan Fisher. Jordan has been doing real estate investing specifically in the multifamily space for 19 years, which is longer than I've been doing it on the fix and flip side. With nearly two decades of experience acquiring, redeveloping and managing multifamily properties, Jordan Fisher is a multifamily investment expert. As Principal of Next Wave, Fisher spearheads the company’s investment strategy, and oversees property selection, renovations, and repositionings to ensure strong results. Prior to joining the executive ranks in commercial real estate, Fisher was founder and CEO of TPG Consulting, LLC, a web development and digital marketing company. Under his leadership, the firm grew from two employees to over 110 with revenues over $21.5 million. TPG was recognized as an INC 500 company as well as one the Los Angeles Business Journal’s 100 fastest growing private companies. In 2014, after running the company for over seven years, Fisher successfully sold the company to a Beijing based multi-national Business Services firm. Prior to founding TPG, Fisher worked at Deloitte Consulting and served as a Captain in the United States Army. A graduate of the U.S. Military Academy at West Point, Fisher earned his MBA from the UCLA Anderson School of Business. Connect with Jordan - https://www.linkedin.com/in/jjfisher/ And after that head on over to... https://easysell411.com https://billyalvaro.com https://billyssecrets.com Who knows maybe you will be our next partner? To get some neat (and FREE) Tools | Tips | Tricks to help you in REI!
Welcome back to Unstoppable REI Wealth. I've been on a mission to bring the experts, the guys who are the beasts of the industry who understand and maximize profits when it comes down to real estate investing and more recently the best for apartment investing. This is because I want to soak up the knowledge myself as much as I want to share the knowledge with all of you.
Apartment investing is the next piece of my evolution where I'm going to be growing into. And so today I'm interviewing Mr. Jordan Fisher. Jordan has been doing real estate investing specifically in the multifamily space for 19 years, which is longer than I've been doing it on the fix and flip side.
With nearly two decades of experience acquiring, redeveloping and managing multifamily properties, Jordan Fisher is a multifamily investment expert. As Principal of Next Wave, Fisher spearheads the company’s investment strategy, and oversees property selection, renovations, and repositionings to ensure strong results. Prior to joining the executive ranks in commercial real estate, Fisher was founder and CEO of TPG Consulting, LLC, a web development and digital marketing company. Under his leadership, the firm grew from two employees to over 110 with revenues over $21.5 million. TPG was recognized as an INC 500 company as well as one the Los Angeles Business Journal’s 100 fastest growing private companies. In 2014, after running the company for over seven years, Fisher successfully sold the company to a Beijing based multi-national Business Services firm. Prior to founding TPG, Fisher worked at Deloitte Consulting and served as a Captain in the United States Army. A graduate of the U.S. Military Academy at West Point, Fisher earned his MBA from the UCLA Anderson School of Business.
Connect with Jordan - https://www.linkedin.com/in/jjfisher/
And after that head on over to...
Who knows maybe you will be our next partner?
To get some neat (and FREE) Tools | Tips | Tricks to help you in REI!
SUMMARY KEYWORDS
deal, jordan, money, market, investors, people, rents, units, multifamily, flip, pay, triplex, renovation, property, growing, grand, started, groups, bought, carve outs
SPEAKERS
Billy, Jordan
Billy 00:10
Welcome to unstoppable real estate investing will My name is Billy Alvaro, aka the unstoppable BA, former billion dollar mortgage banker, gone bankrupt turn professional real estate investor, where each week you'll learn the tools, strategies, systems and secrets myself and other highly successful real estate investing entrepreneurs use to start, grow and scale their businesses creating massive profits and how you can too, and we'll teach you how to put those profits to work. So you no longer have to get ready to finally experience financial freedom and generational wealth now let's get started. What's up? What's up? Welcome back, everybody. Another episode unstoppable Rei wealth. I'm your host, Mr. Billy Alvaro unstoppable BA. And I've been on a mission to start driving in people, experts, the guys who are the beasts of the industry who understand and maximize profits when it comes down to apartment investing. And I'm doing this because I want to soak up the knowledge myself. This is the next piece of my evolution where I'm going to be growing into. And so today I'm interviewing Mr. Jordan Fisher from Cali. Mr. Jordan Fisher has been doing real estate investing specifically in the multifamily space for 19 years just about as long as I've been doing it on the actually longer than I've been doing it on the fix and flip side. So Jordan, brother, welcome to the show.
Jordan 01:31
Hey, thanks so much for having me. It's nice to be here.
Billy 01:34
Good to have you. It's what time is it out there in Cali right now?
Jordan 01:38
it's 8am. So not too early. Yeah. Time to shower, put some pants on.
Billy 01:44
You look good, brother. You're looking good. So Jordan, take me back. You, I see you when you got your MBA your you went to, to West Point, like you're an educated individual, it's unknowable for me to have people in here, not that they're not educated by street but very not normal to have people in here have their MBA graduates with, from what you would do. And so what, what path are you on prior to coming in to doing this with the commercial with apartment investing?
Jordan 02:13
Yes, I've had I've had a few bad paths. So you know, going to West Point, you really you study, I study like physics and electrical engineering, you know, and the reason why, you know, I just thought live classes were good, but you don't, know anything about the civilian world, right? You just know nothing. And, you know, my old man, you know, didn't take me to work when he took me to work. But he, you know, didn't have a career, his own small business. And so I didn't even really know what civilian careers were out there. And so you studied what I studied. And then you get out of the Army, you forget everything you learned in college, right? You serve, you know, there's like, years later, and you're like, I don't know, what do I do? And, you know, so I kind of I did two things. Once one, I got a job just, I was I was pretty good at school. And so I got a job consulting.com Boom, I was like, you know, I'll teach myself how to write software and get a job consulting, but at the same time, I wanted to go back to school to kind of learn, you know, cuz I didn't even take finance, you take marketing and take accounting, you know, all I took were just sort of rigorous, you know, traditional, like, electrical engineering, and then core educational classes. And so, consulting was interesting, but I didn't never really had a passion for for for doing it work. And so, at the time, you know, I ran up debt in the army, and I was like, I was, I was 22. When I when I got out of West Point, I was making seriously 1650 a month that's what they paid a second lieutenant. Yeah. Yeah, I was I was broke. And I was stationed in Hawaii. And so there's a long time ago, but in Hawaii at the time, like gas was a buck 60 which was outrageous, you know, because like, you know, in Kentucky, it was like 60-70 cents a gallon. So I was I was broke. And I ran up credit card debt. And so when I got out, I started consulting. Then I finally paid off my my credit cards, which I thought I seriously would like, I couldn't sleep you know, I was like, I'll never pay off my 10 grand in credit cards. It's unbelievable mountain of debt. And, and when I finally had some money, I'm like, Okay, I should I should do something with this money, what do I do? And a couple times my older brother who kind of he followed the stock market or whatever, he said, you know, this this tech company, it was 100 now it's like 90 cents, you should buy $10,000 with it, and that was just get wiped out, you know, just trying to catch that falling knife. And so I was like, after losing a couple times on stock market gambling, I was like, I'm not I'm not going to do this anymore. And so I kind of read a little bit about multifamily investing. I was like yeah, I think I can do something. And because I was scared to buy like I want a rental housing right and kind of like what you do but you know, for my first investment was like, you know, If I have one unit, and it goes vacant for three months, you know, that's, I'm broke, you know, I'm paying, you know, and so I was like, but if I get a triplex if one person moves out, at least you'll get to to cover the mortgage.
Billy 05:14
The family right there and
Jordan 05:15
that was it. And so I was like, you know, and so, you know, I didn't have a ton of money, but I bought my first triplex. I was I was working in Huntington Beach. If you know Southern California, it's like the northern most Orange County beach town. And I was I was working in Torrance, and right in between the two cities is a place called Long Beach. And you go from Santa Barbara, downtown San Diego, there's really one really bad beachfront area. I mean, it's a crime driven area. It's bad, you know, overall area, and I'm like, you know, it's not gonna stay bad. You know, it's a long time ago. You know, Santa Monica was actually pretty rundown a long time ago. Vance was pretty rundown. Yep. Now, they're really, really expensive. And I was like, you know, Long Beach will turn someday. And so I was driving, I would drive to work. And I would start looking at buildings, and I started looking at reds. And finally I found a deal I thought was really good deal. And I just pulled the trigger. And I think I put like 5% down on the triplex.
Billy 06:11
How old? Were you at that around there?
Jordan 06:14
I was about 29 When I bought my Plex. Yeah.
Billy 06:18
So fast forward. Now. How old are you today?
Jordan 06:21
49.
Billy 06:22
So 49. So at 30 years old, you got into doing this full time, right? Yeah. Did you go straight into large apartment complexes? Did you start with the three family five families? You started trading? That looked like?
Jordan 06:36
Yeah. So I started with a triplex. And then, you know, I bought maybe another I think four Plex. And I just started trading those up, right, because, you know, the thing about multifamily, which I also thought, you know, in in stocks, right, there's, you know, so many stocks traded on a stock exchange, and there's guys like full time, this is what they do, right? They look at these five stocks, these 10 stocks, and they know it way better than any amateurs that we're gonna know it, right. But what I found in real estate was like, this one property, I could be like one of two guys, one of one guys, that are looking at this one property today. And so you can find these little windows where you can get a deal. That's because it's not, it's not a truly transparent market. And you can get a deal that's way below market. And so like my very first deal was, it was awesome, because it was marketed as three one bedroom apartments. And it wasn't it was to one bedroom apartments in a three bedroom house. And so the rents instead of being you know, I think 700 bucks times three, there was two $700 apartments, and then a $1,500 house, it was just totally miss marketed, I just wouldn't close it. And so I just started doing that and trying to find little places where maybe something was undervalued. Or, you know, I could push the rents a little bit, I could retenant it, I could, you know, renovate it, and then sell it at a profit. And then I would do a 1031 exchange because I never wanted to pay taxes, and I buy something bigger. And so I just kind of worked on growing my portfolio one to two deals a year. And, you know, eventually started maybe doing a little bit of friends and family money because you know, it's hard to really just do it all with your own money. And kind of grew up that way. And it's just that for maybe 10 years,
Billy 08:17
how many units you guys have now.
Jordan 08:20
about 2000 2000
Billy 08:22
Beautiful and you concentrated in one specific area. Are you going all over the place?
Jordan 08:27
We are going all over it? We're concentrated, basically west of the Rockies. So we're in Arizona and Nevada, Utah, Oregon, Washington. And then we have one deal in Texas as well.
Billy 08:42
Is there is there a specific reason why you go in West, the Rockies, anything to do with politics?
Jordan 08:50
It's the opposite of that. Right? But that's mostly because, you know, we want direct flights from Orange County. So we go we asset manage, my business partner, David. And we just we can't get do timezones, three timezones, you waste a day traveling there a day traveling back, it's just not worth our time. It's hard. You spent a lot too much time on an airplane. So you know, two hour flight, one timezone, two hour flight, zero timezone changes, and you kind of get in, do your work, get out and have somewhat of a regular life.
Billy 09:24
So Jordan, take me through what's your role in the business and what's David's role, your expertise, like, what are you responsible for?
Jordan 09:30
Yeah, so you know, just two partner for 50-50 partners, I probably am a little stronger on you know, the acquisition side where, you know, really, you know, got more Excel skills, and he he's actually a lawyer, so he does a lot of our contracts. He's actually phenomenal and asset management we we kind of divide up the our markets, mostly based on region where he'll travel to our Southwestern markets. I'll handle the Northwest Just in the Mountain West markets so that way we're not kind of, you know, traveling the same places, you know, you can kind of handle one, one flight now he's got American Airlines miles and I got Alaska miles, you know?
Billy 10:12
Take me through Jordan, I want everybody to get some get some value out of how you guys underwright. So first, how do you go about finding new deals traditional means through brokers.
Jordan 10:22
Yes. I mean, that's, that's primarily we do a lot of networking with brokers. You know, because right, at this point, we're not really looking at anything under 60 units. I mean, we try everyone like 100 units, but for the most, you got pretty sophisticated sellers at 60 units enough, right? It's not, it's not usually a mom and pop that just bought a house that maybe you don't really know what's going on. These guys are all pretty smart. And they don't usually sell, you know, just to the to a guy that calls them up. My team doesn't happen. It's just, it's, it's less likely. And so, you know, we do a lot of networking with brokers, brokers, mostly are pretty good guys to get into the business because they're pretty personal dudes. And so we try and be as clean a buyer as we can be. So that be self we sent it offers that we're going to pay x, we're gonna close on this timeline, you unless there's a real reason to change our offer, we're gonna close on the terms of our offer, you know, we'll stick to the timelines, we'll stick to the price, you know, a lot of people, they, they use their diligence, you know, for 30 days, and then on day 29, they give it a 10% haircut or something, right. And it's causes everybody anxiety, you know, everyone just wants to deal closed, especially the brokers, right. And so we try to try and include clean deals, where it's like, this is what we say we're gonna do, we're gonna do it that way, you know, if they have an off market deal, something that, you know, is pretty hot, they're gonna call us maybe first two or three people
Billy 11:49
assume and Jordan, if you do due diligence, and the numbers are coming in, and you're going through your process and shits a little bit different, you're gonna renegotiate the terms and the price.
Jordan 11:57
It depends, but yeah, I mean, if it's something that's on me that I won't actually, you know, I'll figure out can I make this deal work without renegotiating price? Or really, really try not to, you know, if, if it's something that they haven't disclosed, right, you know, we've had some, some issues, right, that they knew about, they just didn't disclose, and there was no way we're gonna find out until we're doing our due diligence. I'll give you an example. Right? So some people, you know, they're gonna walk the property right now for right, and they're gonna see the asphalt and there's gonna be cracks in it. And then three weeks later, they're gonna say, Well, you know, it's going to be $150,000 to fix the parking lot. So I want to lower my price by $150,000. And to me, you know, I saw that when I walked in, I'm not going to retrain you on stuff that I know, I should have known about that was on me. And so I'm not going to retrain on that. But there are some people that will and so we try to be the guys that don't retrain on stuff that's on us.
Billy 12:56
When you're when you're going in and you're analyzing your deals, what do you look for to do? Like, what kind of returns are you looking for, on your properties, and, and you said earlier that most of your shit you keep, you don't really sell out. So you
Jordan 13:10
no, no, we sell we sell. So if we raised the money, we're doing three to five year olds. Got it. And in the last few years, you know, with prices going up ridiculously quick, we've actually sold I think, 30 deals full cycle, you know, already, even though we're only been around eight years, what we look for mostly is something that we want to bring return to our investors, right? We're looking for high teens returns to our investors. And, you know, if you can get something that's built in the late 90s, maybe early 2000s, that's really just a cosmetic upgrade. Right? That's the best, right? Because it's the lowest risk, right? Yeah, we never get those deals, we either get a deal, we get a deal, it's older, we get a deal, it's in a bad neighborhood. And those are gonna be higher risk, because you just don't know what variables are going to come up, you know, I mean, you're gonna 70s building, there's a good chance, you're gonna have a sewer leak, you're gonna have a tree root into your sewer line, and you're gonna have like a $5,000 pop that you weren't planning for. You just, you just gotta have that budget, just know that you don't know everything, there's going to be random stuff that breaks, the older the property is. And it's likewise, you know, if you go in a bad neighborhood, you're gonna have more evictions than you planned for. And when you do an eviction, the turn after the eviction is gonna cost you weigh more than typical turn, right? They're gonna, people are pissed when they get kicked out, right? They they Bust the doors, they bust the wall. So you got a lot of drywall damage, you know, they might steal your appliances, you know, it's just a it's just a way more expensive turn when you're doing higher evictions of bad neighborhoods, older properties. We do um, but, you know, we kind of try to build a lot more padding into those deals, because there's going to be just these things that happen that you don't plan for.
Billy 14:56
Yeah, I love it. And you're you're how many are you doing all of the analysts? Are you analyzing everything? Or you have a team that does that for you?
Jordan 15:05
Yeah, so we have, you know, we have a small team, right, we've got, we've got an asset manager, we have an analyst, that helps us do, you know, the underwriting. But at the end of the day, we're not a big team. And David and I are heavily involved in every single deal. I mean, really heavily down to, you know, every single assumption on the model, we are walking all the comps to make sure we believe in the renovated rents, you know, working with the contractors, make sure that we understand the costs of the renovations. So we do have a, you know, we're big enough where we have some assistance, but we're not so big that Dave and I aren't involved in every single deal.
Billy 15:42
How many? How many deals Jordan, do you think your, your team needs to review? Before we actually get a deal? So what does that look like ratio wise, you have any idea?
Jordan 15:52
I would say we're maybe one out of 30 Or 40? I mean, we barely, it's okay. I mean, we really don't compete on like, broadly marketed deals, right? If it's gonna, you know, the brokers got it, and he's broadly marketing it, and there's gonna be a call for offer. We never win those. I mean, there's just guys that they've got, they're better at raising money. They maybe have investors that accept lower returns than us. We just don't win those things. And so or they have more aggressive assumptions. And David, and I, you know, we're here to do deals we're not, you know, everyone says they're conservative, but we try to be realistic. We're not we're here to do deals. But we're not going to like lie to ourselves, we got to be something we really believe in
Billy 16:37
31 out of 40 is a good number, because there's a lot of guys interview that, you know, it's one out of 101 out of 150. They have to look through to see if they're and they make the offers, but they just don't get them accepted.
Jordan 16:48
Yeah, yeah. I mean, it's a lot of work. But yeah, I mean, I think one out of 30 is about right. But again, we're not looking at every single deal to begin with, we kind of just give it a look, and are we gonna be competitive on this deal? And, like, you know, pretty much anything over, I would say 30 million, we're probably it's probably too big for us. Anything under maybe 7 million is probably not worth our time. And so you know, there's ways that you kind of filter out deals just are they are, are they deals that we can look at and spend time on? Before we even really dig in?
Billy 17:21
Do you have an idea? And I know every deal is different, but your properties that you're buying somewhere around 1980 9090? Somewhere around there? Do you have a cost per unit that is taking you to renovate in your assumptions?
Jordan 17:35
It's kind of different market by market? But yeah, I mean, I think renovations have gone up a ton. I mean, materials have gone up a ton labor has gone up a fortune. So most of our units now are like 17-18k grand for renovation. And like four years ago, we were paying like 9-10k.
Billy 17:50
Wow. And that's is that a full pole? Is that just a push and pull or full gut?
Jordan 17:57
So it's probably halfway in between, right? That's where you're, you know, flooring is usually three to four grand appliances, you know, 2500 paint, you know, maybe 2000, you're gonna have to replace all of the hardware parts. It's 2500. And then Labor's like, maybe four or five grand, you know. And so if you want to replace doors, if you want to do baseboards, and it just goes up from there, you know? Yep, yep. Yep, I
Billy 18:19
know. It's it definitely got expensive OBS for sure, man. COVID just put everything through the roof. Yeah. This is cool, bro. All right. So tell me your money. Walker is your capital partners. What do you guys do for that? Do you? Is it your own cash? Do you guys raising capital was that look like?
Jordan 18:35
Yeah, we're raising capital we've got so we started off. You know, Dave and I, we really, we didn't know probably a single person that would give us a $25,000 check. And when we started, you know, neither of us. We didn't grew a grow up with Country Club money. Neither of us are particularly good networkers. And so we started this, and there's a friend that kind of brokered, you know, like, he worked with money raisers, and he found people were willing to raise money for us. And so now, and then at the time, we would, we would raise, and we started to raise money, just small amounts, you know, like 100 grand, and our first deal to up to 400 grand. And so now we've got about, you know, eight years later, we got a group of us are made about 125 people that that have invested with us, and they're all pretty happy with us, all the deals have done pretty well. And so, depending on the size of the deal, you know, our network, we can raise, you know, maybe five to 6 million bucks, and if we need more than we work with, like a third party fundraiser for the remainder. So we've worked with a number of groups that do fundraising you know, and people have heard of some of them, you know, like Realty mogul, or some of these online groups that do fundraising. And so, you know, between the two we can cobble together you know, about 10 million bucks.
Billy 19:51
and so somebody like Realty mogul or a third party who's doing the raising, we are what are they what's they're taking the deal, and they get paid.
Jordan 19:58
Most of them will charge the deal for them. On raising, so they'll they'll charge some points. And it's the various, you know, different groups charge maybe anywhere from, you know, maybe three points to five points on the deal. And then a lot of times, you know, I won't see it because they'll come in other investors will come in as an LLC, we won't have direct contact with their investors. And I think they charge they also charge their investors some fees on the on the other side, but we don't really see that.
Billy 20:24
So what do you have you have Realty mobile? And what's a couple of other the other companies third party?
Jordan 20:29
There's a company called into? Yeah, they're actually out of Israel. There's another group that we've worked with called flagship out of Texas. And so there's just different groups out there that, you know, they're kind of sub institutional, right? Where these groups, they'll they'll do three to $6 million checks. And, you know, kind of you look for like a 10 to $20 million check. It's kind of a different group of people that raise more,
Billy 20:58
are they getting any type of the the group was putting together not the investors were going into the equity stake in the deal as well? Were they baking it into the LLC?
Jordan 21:09
I think they bake it in like, I think they get a share, you know, a lot of them co invest with their investors. And I think they might they get a share of some of the upsides, but they charge it, their investors are paying that, you know, not the deal.
Billy 21:22
Guys, is it expensive working with groups like that?
Jordan 21:25
Yeah, it is, you know, I mean, charges the deal, you know, again, if they're charging four points on the money, or the deal has to come up with that. And so, it is expensive, but it's worth it. Right, you know, you get the deal done. And, you know, if the investment can support it, then it can support it. So, you know, it's it loves the way to make it happen. Yeah.
Billy 21:43
I love it. This is this is good shit bro. I should now take me through. You guys take the asset down. I don't want to go through due diligence process. I want to go to actual renovating of the property. Do you have your own in house teams that oversee that? Are you third party it was that look like?
Jordan 22:00
Yeah, so we self manage. So we have, you know, about 60 employees across our, our market markets that are the boots on the ground, right, we employ them, we self manage everything from collecting rents, to leasing, to maintaining, and then we don't hire a general contractor, generally, our asset management team So David, myself, or other asset manager will go, you know, hire all the subs and manage the different trades that will do the renovation, whether it's, yeah, we want to we try and be really, really quick because speed matters, right? Because you see, market can change really quickly, right? And so, you as soon as we close, we want to get the big ticket items, you know, done where you want to get the paint, if it's a new brand, get the new brand done, get the landscaped on new signage, if we you know, if we're gonna redo the the pools or the amenities, get that stuff done, those are big ticket items and get them done. We like to start like the same week that we close, if possible, and then and then after that, you just kind of it's more interiors, you know, as people turn then you're gonna renovate those interiors push the rents. And that's the nitty gritty that takes you the remainder of the two to five years. Right.
Billy 23:14
Are you who on the team is has the construction background? Anybody?
Jordan 23:18
Nope, nope, no, none of us are contractors. But, you know, we're, we're renovating, we're not building ground up. Right. And so definitely while you get a good feel for what, what is the exterior paint cost? What is a reroof? Cost? What is what is, you know, the interior renovations cost? So, we've done these so many times, we have a pretty good handle on it.
Billy 23:39
What do you what are you hoping to do over the next like 5-10 years, you and your partner like what's your plans?
Jordan 23:45
You know, I think goal number one is to never, ever do a bad deal, right? You know, everybody wants to grow and all that stuff. And we do too. But we don't like we don't want to grow at the expense of our relationship. I can't imagine you know, we've got friends, we got family, we got neighbors and invest with us, I don't want to run into anyone and say, You know what, that we probably shouldn't have done that feel sorry, you know, number one goal is to never do a bad deal. And, and then number two, you know, we both really enjoy it, I think we'd like to do a little bit more balance of, you know, maybe stuff that's a little less hot, you know, maybe do a 10 year hold that's instead of high teens IRR is maybe a 13 or 14% IRR. But you hold on for longer, less intense, less pressure, you know, maybe less leverage and just kind of have a little bit of a mix of long term holds. And
Billy 24:40
that's one of my questions like a lot of these syndicators right there, even though they're not flipping like yeah, your house flip, right? It's every six months to a year either building renovating, flipping. You get into long term capital gains great you get into the appreciation, but you're still turning it over. Like you're really never getting that to where you're growing your Your wealth, your time. So what? What are you doing with the money that you take in? Are you putting it into other deals that you you're holding personally for long term wealth building, because like, as I'm asking is for my own self, because I like I want to start building big. But I don't want to see myself every five to seven years, having to flip and get into new deals, I want to start accumulating the syndication point, I know, I'm gonna have to flip the frame to get my investors back. But like, what are you doing with that?
Jordan 25:29
Yeah, so it's a balance, right. So I do have my own personal portfolio. And my personal portfolio, you know, I call segregate. And that helps me to defer taxes on our promotes and stuff for the flipping, right. And so, you get enough cost segregation, you get enough depreciation, and those losses will offset your, your, your gains and your promotes. So it's important for that, I definitely have my own portfolio of deals that I just hold, and I, you know, hold five to 10 years, and hopefully it will 1031 those and keep growing that. That's it. That's, yeah, that's, that's the way it is. And so, you know, it's great, you know, before we started syndicating, I had like, 60 apartments in Long Beach. Now, I have a personal portfolio of about 500 units, you know, in different markets.
Billy 26:13
besides I guess, building that you have? Well, I
Jordan 26:18
Well I think my smalest is 20 units, and my my largest is 110.
Billy 26:22
So you are taking the money from the one side and you syndication? You putting it into your own side? Yeah, eating and growing your wealth on the other side? That's smart.
Jordan 26:29
Yeah, that's, that's what I'm primarily doing. And then, but you do like when you know, these loans, as you get into bigger loans, they've got they've got net worth requirements, you've got liquidity requirements, you know, we got earnest money, we got, you know, did every deal. So we do have to keep a lot of just cash that goes in and out for facilitating the deals. So that's also an important part of being a sponsor.
Billy 26:51
Yeah. And that's, that's another good question that leads me to are you and your partner signing on every every deal? Do you have somebody else that comes in for like larger ones for network? Yeah.
Jordan 27:01
So far, we've never done a deal that we couldn't sign for, you know, just for your listeners that are not familiar. Most of the loans we have, in fact, all of them are non recourse. But even though they're not, even though they're non recourse, right, there are recourse carve outs. So if you do some bad boy stuff, if you do any fraud, anything, then it becomes recourse. Right. And so they want a warm body, the sign of those, those non recourse carve outs. It's huge. Yeah, that's a good play. Brother, if, if people want to get in touch with you find out more about Jordan Fisher, where do they go?
27:35
So our website is Next Wave investors.com You can always email me at Jordan at NWI for next wave investors multifamily.com. So Jordan@nwimultifamily.com probably two easiest ways to get in touch with me. And yeah, love to talk more.
Billy 27:51
You are a social media guy.
Jordan 27:53
I've got a LinkedIn profile. But you know, this is not a face that's made for Instagram. So
Billy 28:00
this has been a pleasure getting to know you and I appreciate you coming on Jordan. Thanks so much.
Jordan 28:04
Awesome. Thanks for talking to me.